From what I understand, pagans (specifically Wiccans) don't believe in a "devil-figure".. could someone explain who these "demons" I keep seeing being referenced are? (that's a painful sentence, sorry lol) As in, "don't summon a demon" or "attached an evil spirit" kinda thing. I know there are various deities that represent a specific emotion or thing or occurrence, but I didn't think there were evil spirits? If someone could just explain it would be much appreciated. :P

~ K

P.S. I'm asking here because I don't entirely trust the internet, ESPECIALLY on the topic of Wicca and demons.

In my humble opinion.... from everything that I've read, researched, etc. Wicca does not personify evil into one entity. Things are not so cut and dry. If you have battled addiction, experienced sorrow or heartbreak, you have battled demons. Demons are more or less negative energy. Everything has a positive and a negative aspect. Some lean more one way than the other. The ultimate enlightment should include a balance of both. This comes from someone that would be considered gray in the path. Positive chaos. I really don't label, too confining. Hope this clears things up a bit.

I am not Wican, just a garden variety Witch.... I see "Wican " as a Religion - and I will make my own, thanks. We (puny humans) give Names to things that we have little knowledge of. Angels, Demons, Fae........ how are we to know the difference ?? I do think it is safe to say there are Beings greater than Us, be they good or ill....... and let it go at that.

Thanks you guys, input is appreciated! I understand what you mean, Amythyst, about the labels and whatnot.. I agree it all gets too picky over names. I just wasn't sure.. in fact I'm not sure about a lot of stuff about Wicca, guess that's why I'm still learning :P Linn I agree with you too. Just when we start talking about angels and demons and other mystical beings I'm a little confused as to where the line is drawn between what pagans truly believe and what we are told we believe.. ugh. Anyway, thanks again both for you information!

~K

Wicca is a form of spirituality that allows you to create your own version of how you like to worship. Because it is so all inclusive there is much contradiction in terms of what each individual person who says they practice Wicca believe. I don't qualify myself as a Wicca Witch, just a witch, because I incorporate many philosophies into my practice that are not Wicca based. In most religions there has been references to other entities of power that do not completely exist in our sphere of influence. There are good entities like angels and those that will harm you who are called demons or devils, but are simply negative entities. Demons exist therefore just as much as Angels, like two sides of a coin, you can't have one without the other. The problem is that when you are practicing magick unless you understand this concept you can fall prey to inviting negative entities (such as demons) to be attracted to you. Negative entities come in many varieties and therefore have different levels of power, similar to how angels have a heirarchal structure of power. (That is why there are cherebum, seraphin, angels, archangles, etc.) A demon is a very powerful negative entity according to this scheme. The devil in many religious is used interchangeably with demon, because he is a powerful negative entity. In many cases Judeo-Christianity tends to do this exclusively, but it is not entirely accurate.

While it is true that in modern times we have realized that people who would have in the past been termed "possessed by demons" when they had mental illness, these are not to be confused with true demonic possessions. Even though the Christian Churches and even New Age and many pagan derivatives have been trying to brush the concept of negative entities in other realms or dimensions as not real, this is counterintuitive as if you have positive entities such as various gods and goddesses, angels, guides, etc., energetically it is impossible for their not then to also be the other negative entities as well. So in my opinion, based on the vast histories of religion from all cultures, negative entities do exist and the notion that they are simply mental illness or some other aspect of psychology of humans is an untruth and should not be embraced if you plan on practicing witchcraft. A healthy fear of the unknown and the many trophic energy levels of the multiverse is important in understanding magick. But of course this is my personal opinion.

namaste,
JB

As everyone else has stated - In my opinion and in accordance with the path I walk:
The only demons are those we carry within ourselves, our fears, unacknowledged desires, repressed feelings or memories. These can manifest themselves in many ways from behavioral issues to a manifestation of the energies. Spiritual entities are neither good or evil - they are what they are, and what they are strongly depends on how you approach them.
If you are raising energies for magick without those inner demons being calmed and you are calling on a spiritual entity as well then your magick can have negative consequences even if your intentions are the best. The first step in magick is always to calm your mind and center yourself.

Thanks all for your input. I think I understand it now.

Blessed Be!
~K

maybe THEY don't believe in a 'Devil-figure' -- but IT still believes in THEM!
LOL
be good

well, what I mean is that to a Wiccan (not sure how many are here) life isn't divided by "good" and "evil" like it is to a Christian or whatever. there isn't *A* God and *A* Devil. so I was just confused by devil references I see but it's more clear now.

sorry i was just being silly
"be good" -- "hurt none"
what goes around comes around -- law of three
karma - you will pay for every good deed
same thing to me

the "Patriarchy" gets in trouble when it personifies GOD - the Supreme Personality of Godhead
and then tries to blame evil on the "Devil" - because it has no recognition or place for the Feminine aspect
If one is going to perceive the Divine as possessing a personality (which i usually do)
then one must recognize that if their is a GOD - there is also a GODDESS - no? (Or at least a Hermaphroditic GOD)
So - in denial - the unrecognized feminine aspect becomes the Devil, - or the "Church" or Nature
What i am trying to say is that - if their is one GOD -'IT' will invariable be two (or more) gods male and female - the GODS

In the Bible (Torah) -- there are many names for GOD and "Elohim" is the plural name for GOD -- the GODS
In Genesis - when GOD says "Let us make MAN in OUR image ... MALE and Female created HE them"
the actual name used for GOD (not translated by the "Christians") is Elohim - the GODS - which explains why GOD is talking to himself in the plural
Much of the sexist problem is due to the structure of our languages - MAN in this instance meant men AND women - Mankind - Humankind etc
-- "He" referring to God - didn't mean just a Male aspect - but both, We have the same problems in our own English expressions - do we say he, she, it or they when referring to mixed or undefined people? Do we say mankind - when we mean humankind or people?
English is very sexist at its core ...
Suppose i am talking about a friend and i say "oh my friend works at the shop around the corner"
well - either we have to find out the name of my friend so we can refer to "my friend" in the conversation without saying "friend" all the time
or we have to find out the gender of my "friend" so we can make the required choice of pronoun "he or she" - don't we? (or dehumanize the friend by using 'it' or 'they')
"what is his/her name?" - we never say THAT do we? We make assumptions of gender based on the name.
I reminds me of that SNL sketch about gender ambiguity using names like Chris and Pat -- not so easy to assume "he or she" is it?
Incidentally i really love the word " Friend" - because not only is it not gender-specific - but it isn't even species, or entity specific - is it?
It isn't like brother, sister, mother, father, husband, wife, boyfriend, girlfriend, son, daughter - is it.
I like words like friend, lover, child, children, spouse (if necessary), person - but I can see we have a bit of problem with the terms
"human, and mankind" - it really doesn't feel inclusive of women so much does it - omgs - neither are "women" or "woman" is it?
I can understand how living with that all the time, everyday, everywhere would kinda bug me too.

So we are forced into this male-female differentiation in the simplest expressions - no wonder it permeates our life.
Since i am already babbling - off subject - more than i intended, i would just like to point out that i am a pagan
but i am also a pantheist, Taoist, and a monotheist - they are all just different points of view for different circumstances.
(I may even be an agnostic at times for objectivity's sake - but I am NEVER an ATHEIST - that takes way too much faith in the ridiculous)
These disputes and disagreements are very childish to me - it is people's actions that define what they really believe.
I believe in SPIRIT which of course means SPIRITS - and from that comes the Great Spirit, spirits of nature, GOD, GODS, the FORCE,
MOTHER NATURE, Father TIME- demons, daimons, angels, fairies, elementals -- everything ALIVE.
Christ IS Dionysus IS Krsna IS Horus IS Lug - they are the same mythological archetype expressed through different times, cultures and people.
If there is any evil or Devil in my point of view -- it must be the Denial of Spirit, or disparaging of the intelligent loving creative force in the Universe
TRUE ATHEISM and the doctrine that we have evolved and are just a lucky accident and the Universe is run by chance or mindless laws and rules
-- well if I have an evil or sin or Devil in my philosophy - than that would be it

thanx for listening

wyrdric